New Pentagon Video from Judicial Watch FOIA request

Response to snopes.com pentagon "rumor"




Snopes "urban legend" posting ...

snopes.com/rumors/pentagon.htm

discussion board ...


Claim:
The damage to the Pentagon on September 11 was caused by something other than a hijacked Boeing 757's being crashed into its side.
Status: False


Snopes uses the "Hunt the Boeing site", while I have respect for this site, it was the first one on the web, and did make some mistakes. It also did not have all the photos at hand when the site came out.

Snopes claim...

Despite the appearances of exterior photographs, the Boeing 757-200 did not "only damage the outside of the Pentagon." It caused damage to all five rings (not just the outermost one) after penetrating a reinforced, 24-inch-thick outer wall. As 60 Minutes II reported in their "Miracle of the Pentagon" episode on 28 November2001, the section of the Pentagon into which the hijacked airliner was flown had just been reinforced during a renovation project.

Unfortunately, this user wasn't able to download the link Snopes provided. Maybe they should update their links.
As far as the hole goes (which I believe they are mentioning).

"We made several modifications to the building as part of that renovation that we think helped save people's lives," says Lee Evey, who runs a billion-dollar project to renovate the Pentagon. They've been working on it since 1993. The first section was five days from being finished when the terrorists hit it with the plane.
The renovation project built strength into the 60-year-old limestone exterior with a web of steel beams and columns.
"You have these steel tubes and, again, they go from the first floor and go all the way to the fifth floor," says Evey. "We have everything bolted together in a strong steel matrix. It supports and encases the windows and provides tremendous additional strength to the wall."
When the plane hit at 350 miles an hour, the limestone layer shattered. But inside, those shards of stone were caught by a shield of cloth that lines the entire section of the building.
It is a special cloth that helps prevent masonry from fragmenting and turning into shrapnel. The cloth is also used to make bullet-resistant vests.
All of this, especially the steel, held up the third, fourth and fifth floors. They stayed up for 35 minutes. You can see them through the smoke, suspended over the hole gouged by the jet. Only after the evacuation did the heat melt the new steel away. Evey says that without the reconstruction, the floors might have collapsed immediately.

Ah ! That explains it, a piece of cloth stopped an airliner going 450mph ! OK, sure....

pentagon collapse september 11
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"heat melt the new steel away"
"You have these steel tubes and, again, they go from the first floor and go all the way to the fifth floor," says Evey. "We have everything bolted together in a strong steel matrix."
"All of this, especially the steel, held up the third, fourth and fifth floors"

Well, Lee, nothing looks bolted together here.
As far as the heat goes, there is a chair with an open book on it, the pages are not even singed !


open book closeup

Pentagon Damage chair 9 11

Exterior photographs are misleading because they show only the intact roof structures of the outer rings and don't reveal that the plane penetrated all the way to the ground floor of the third ring. As a U.S. Army press release noted back on 26 September 2001, one engine of the aircraft punched a 12-foot hole through the wall of the second ring:

This hole?
pentagon exit hole

You mean this engine?
Aircraft debris inside the Pentagon

DoD News Briefing on Pentagon Renovation
September 15, 2001

Mitchell: It's more to the right of where we were at. This is the -- this is in a renovated section on the opposite side, if you were facing the opposite side. This is a hole in -- there was a punch-out. They suspect that this was where a part of the aircraft came through this hole, although I didn't see any evidence of the aircraft down there.

Then you didnt click my link, I see the evidence ?

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pentagon exit hole puch out hole
Does this closeup look like something pushed through from the inside?
The words "punch out" kinda give it away....

Q: Which area is that?
Mitchell: This is right inside the E Ring.
Q: Did you see any evidence of the aircraft anywhere?
Mitchell: Yes, I did. You could see just small pieces of it.
Q: Well, how far in? Again, we're trying to figure how it came into the building.
Q: Can we finish the video first and then we'll go back?
Mitchell: You can see someone from the Montgomery County unit here.
This pile is all Pentagon metal. None of that is aircraft whatsoever. As you can see, they've punched a hole in here. This was punched by the rescue workers to clean it out. You can see this is the -- some of the unrenovated areas where the windows have blown out. That's soldiers from the Third U.S. Infantry, the Honor Guard, are in there. And this is the conditions they have to work in. There's the Tyvek suits, the respirators, goggles, and helmets, and they also have boots on them as well.
Q: Where is that exactly? Between which rings?
Mitchell: Between the -- I believe it's the E and D Rings.
And that's the end of the tape.

So which is it? Did they "punch the hole out? Or did something push through?
www.defenselink.mil/news/Sep2001/t09152001_t915evey.html

september 11 pentaogn exit hole missile
I see somthing that pushed through, but it wsnt the nose of the craft. Whatever it was , it was appoximately 8ft around.


Recall that when the first airliner was flown into a World Trade Center tower on September 11- before it was known that the "accident" was really part of a deliberate terrorist attack - newscasters were speculating that a small plane had accidentally flown into the side of the tower, because the visible exterior damage didn't seem as extensive as what people thought a large airliner would cause. Even though the two airplanes that hit the World Trade Center towers were travelling faster at the time of impact than the Pentagon plane was (400 MPH vs. 350 MPH), hit aluminum-and-glass buildings rather than reinforced concrete walls, and didn't dissipate much of their energy striking the ground first (as the Pentagon plane did), they still barely penetrated all the way through the WTC towers

Barely penetrated the towers? Gimme a break.

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eyewitnesses

The plane banked sharply and came in so low that it clipped light poles. It slammed into the side of the Pentagon at an estimated 350 miles per hour after first hitting the helipad. The plane penetrated the outer three rings of the building.

Well, i have a hard time understanding how a person can see through 3 rings of the Pentagon?
The original hole was 18ft accross before the wall collapsed.


Immediately after Flight 77 smashed into the Pentagon, the impact was obscured by a huge fireball, explosions, fire, smoke, and water from firefighting efforts. Within a half hour, the upper stories of the building collapsed, thereby permanently obscuring the impact site. It simply wasn't possible for photographs to capture a clear view of the impact site during that brief interval between the crash and the collapse.
(oh, that explains how the guy saw through all 3 rings :)

AND, Thats why SNOPES doesnt bother to post THIS picture....

facade hole too small for plane boeing 757
click here for large version
By the way, these cars would have been in the way of the left wing.
The "plane" would have had to be on an angle to clear the generator.

car and windows september 11

You'll recall from the discussions above that the hijacked airliner did not "only hit the ground floor of the Pentagon's first ring" - it struck the Pentagon between the first and second floors and blasted all the way through to the third ring. Because the plane disappeared into the building's interior after penetrating the outer ring, it wasn't visible in photographs taken from outside the Pentagon. Moreover, since the airliner was full of jet fuel and was flown into thick, reinforced concrete walls at high speed, exploding in a fireball, any pieces of wreckage large enough to be identifiable in after-the-fact photographs taken from a few hundred feet away burned up in the intense fire that followed the crash (just as the planes flown into the World Trade Center towers burned up, and the intensity of their jet-fuel fires caused both towers to collapse).
Jet fuel doesn't burn hot enough to melt steel. If it did, it would melt the engine. do a google search on this yourself.
911-strike.com/pentagon.htm has a good analysis.


Small pieces of airplane debris were plainly visible on the Pentagon lawn in other photographs, however, such as the one below:
flight 77 debris
Several people have done analysis on this piece shown on this page. It is too small to have come from a 757.
"First of all, the question concerning the aircraft, there are some small pieces of aircraft visible from the interior during this fire-fighting operation I'm talking about, but not large sections. In other words, there's no fuselage sections and that sort of thing." "You know, I'd rather not comment on that.
good decision

The claim that the "Defence Secretary" ordered the lawn to be sanded over is false
I agree, thats the first thing Snopes got right. Remember,
Snopes is using the FIRST web site that didn't go with the official story.

BUT, mentioning that, there would have been thousnads of gallons of fuel,
and by EPA law, this should have been cleaned. It was not.
There were no "pools" of fuel, and if it had all ignited, it would have burned for days.
Look again at the book that was in pristine condition.



As the front of the Boeing 757 hit the Pentagon, the outer portions of the wings likely snapped during the initial impact, then were pushed inward towards the fuselage and carried into the building's interior; the inner portions of the wings probably penetrated the Pentagon walls with the rest of the plane. Any sizable portions of the wings were destroyed in the explosion or the subsequent fire. Nonetheless, damage to the building caused by the plane's wings is plainly visible in photographs, such as the one below (note the blackened sections on both sides of the impact site)

The rest of the wings were destroyed in the fire eh ?
Look again at the photo with the cars, there are TREE branches.
OK, the branches survived, but you cant find a 6 inch part of wing cause it burned???


Snopes admitted that the plane hit the second floor, so the tail would have hit at least the third.

Pentagon 911 enhanced attack photos

pentagon hole closeup

The "wing root" is the strongest part of the plane, if this is where the plane hit, as we are told,
the wing roots would have hit the edges of this hole. The left side of the hole shows windows that aren't broken.
There is also NO damage on top of the hole where the tail would have hit.
Remember, Snopes says that the wings "folded up" and the whole airliner entered this 18ft hole




So a 757 totally dissappeared inside the building?
and this is the photo Snopes gives to prove it?

pentagon small 911

This shows the size of the plane against the building.
pentagon graphic 9/11

graphic wing Sept 11 no plane

The cars would have been in the way of the left wing.
Snopes did say that the plane hit the ground first right ?

debris damage snopes rumor legend urban

car and gas bottles


pentagon lawn 20010911

I sure don't see any gouge marks, the engine and fuselage hang LOWER than the rest of the plane.
(nice lawn, bet they use fertilizer, all the BULL coming from of this admin would do nicely)


click here for LARGE version of above photo

no debris on lawn





snopes response photo september 11 2001 9/11 click here for large version


pentagon hole

Hunt for a 100 ton Boeing !
Hunt for a food tray, fork, luggage, a shoe string....????
This is before the wall collapsed, so no one took anything from the site.

cable reels september 11

The right wing HAD to clear the generator (below pic) , BUT, the damage is at the ground floor ? (above pic)
The plane did NOT nose dive into the pentagon, it hit sevral lamp poles hundereds of feet away, it came in LEVEL.
How did the damage happen only on the BOTTOM floor?
Snopes doesnt bother mentioning these tid bits....


damage 9-11 2001

SNOPES...
Update:
A video presentation unleashed on the Internet in August 2004 rehashes the same conspiracy claims. It can be found at a number of locations, including:




http://www.911review.org: 
Home Page,
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